Fate is ･･･?
three dots
sex
bor + ing
Mastered Shooting Juice up Nose!
NAGISA WILL STEAL YOUR SOUL.
KYOU WILL ROCK YOUR WORLD.
DANGOS WILL MOE OVERLOAD.
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It's shit like every other visual novel based anime, right?
Do you want us to replay "LITERATURE"?
If so,it's monotonous
Clannad is terrible. It's as cliché as it gets.
i don't think clannad is shit, better wash your mouth before you talk of this excellent series
It's awesome like every other visual novel-based anime.
Key shows is way better then the stupid shit anime some people watch. Plus, Clannad is teh superior of all other animus.
I haven't watched Clannad yet, but the other Key shows, and most of all Kanon, are nearly unwatchable once you realize the immense underlying emotional immaturity they represent.
JUUKEN SENTAI!
GEKIRENJAA!
DOZO
>>15
As opposed to say, shounen battle shows, which are really mature.
what
Shounen shows are far more honest than Key shows. Shounen shows are about simple emotions - struggle, friendship, justice - and seldom pretend to be much else. Key's shows, on the other hand, are dressed up as if they are romantic drama, but there is very little in the way of actual romance in them, and they are actually much more about placating the fear of women and human relations that their intended audience feels.
Shounen shows are for people who want to see endless battling and people getting riled up even if there's no reason to. Key shows are for people who want to put all that frenetic childishness behind them and just imagine a world where stuff is slowly falling into place.
Key anime is not exactly the most plausible of romantic drama out there, but they're fun shows. They're head and shoulders above most other visual novel/eroge conversion anime, at least part of which is the fault of Kyoto Animation, so you have to give them credit where credit's due.
Oh, and you kind of have to accept that the show started life as a visual novel/eroge and you have to set aside biases before you can enjoy them for what they are. It's a sad thing if you can't, however.
Shows aren't honest or dishonest anyway. Shows are just shows, it's people's interpretations which attach honesty to an inanimate thing (no pun intended there.)
this anime is the most awesomist
No, sorry. Key shows are for people who are afraid of women, and relationships, and need a fantasy where these things are safe and non-threatening.
Kyoani's work is increidble, there is no doubt about that. But the stories are not theirs, and they are the problem. As for "for what they are", that is what I am talking about. They are escapist fantasies for the otaku, NEET and hikikomori.
>>26
No anime stories are written by studios.
That's bullshit, and you know it.
Funny, I always figured the key games were in regards to the specific themes they wish to institute. For example if you look at the titles to the games such as clannad and kanon or even air.
The titles refer to the main theme.
In the themes for clannad, the entire situation deals with the main chars conflict of seeing nagisa with a family, and with his own battered life, working to have a family of his own in a sense. He was inspired by nagisas family whereas he had no form of a family. I likely messed that up because I keep getting asked questions. So lets just say its about family and one mans search for one. Afterall, the central focus was nagisas story. but the fantasy world revealed a sort of miracle that would later play a role. the replays through the differant storylines were ment to aquire emotional states...or something of that nature, Sorry that is a bit hazy because the kanji is unreconizable to me and I keep getting emotions. Could be wrong though.
Kanon Is the story of the building of a miracle. For example, yuichis past was built by the interaction with the girls, au makoto (fox) mai and nayuki.
The name is ment to say that with each repitition, the story builds upon what was learned. in the end, a miracle, which is mentioned throughout the earlier storylines, is enabled to happen for the finale and the main real woman (ayu)
You can see these themes in all of keys works though.
The debate that the key stories are ment to be escapist fantasies should also perhaps note that any story or even love story can be seen as an escapist fantasy (Trashy love novels much?)
Maybe thats just me though...
And if so, then these are simply things I came to understand from an objective view.
Nagisa is one of the few lead girls that I actually liked. In retrospect, Ayu was alright but I found myself more intrested in makotos story and I wasnt too huge on mizuhos lead char either.
So, to have Nagisa as a main girl who would actually strike me as an intresting character says something.
> The debate that the key stories are ment to be escapist fantasies should also perhaps note that any story or even love story can be seen as an escapist fantasy (Trashy love novels much?)
This is true to some extent, but really, you can't exactly claim that all love stories are trashy love novels.
Even when being restricted to just anime, there are stories with a hundred times the emotion and heart of any given Key game. Honey & Clover, or Kare Kano, are stories about real people, and the ups and downs of their relationships.
Kanon, on the other hand, hardly even qualifies as being about humans. The girls that aren't outright non-human are embarrassingly immature, and stupid the point of being just plain retarded. They do not behave like real humans. Their relationships aren't even remotely reminescent of those of a regular human. They can function in society only because the writers boldly claim that they can. They are walking embodiments of the hangups of your average otaku.
I agree to an extent about the realism of them. However, I do not see it soley as the characters. Really, it is the theme of the story which makes Kanon stand out to me.
Also ^_^; I wasnt saying that all love stories are trashy love novels. What i was meaning, was that alot of those basic love novels which are considered somewhat trashy cause they are the same thing and usually incorperate eroge, are writte in such a way that the reader more or less fantasises about putting themselves into that position.
The same could be said about Kanon unfortunatly.
I happen to like kanon immensly. Not because of just the characters. Ayu, for instance. I didnt really like her. there wre aspects about who she was as a person that irritated me, and the way that shiori kind of naturally stuck to him was soewhat believeable, but pushed things a bit.
Makoto, well she had her quirks, Mostly I found her story to be while unrealistic, something that could come out of a fantasy novel. Which, really, is what Kanon was, Modern fantasy set in a realistic enviroment.
But the fantasy of the story wasnt the key point. nor was the characters. The story Key was going for was the theme of canon itself. the minor repetitiveness and differances in choice which build over time to a sort of finale. This was a key to remember in the ayu saga. The mysteries behind akikos recovery in nayukis story and sayuris survival in mais arc tied into the story of ayu. hence where that name came from.
It was really that level of storytelling which made it intresting. Ever 17 took a similar approach, but really removed alot of questions. The story was a bit more complex and alot of ever 17s story was laid out in a cryptic fashion which confused alot of people.
However, in visual novel ratings, I am forced to say that I have a set list of all time favorites:
1.) Kana Imouto
2.) ever 17
3.) Kanon.
I really rate them based upon the story entirely. The most controversial story on there, that being kana, was really a very powerfull and well thought out story. (let the OMGWTFBBQ comments about the incest theme in kana commence -_- )
Aside from such controversial points, the storylines focused on thought provoking issues revolving around death and love.
Sow was the best example of this especially kanas comment of:
"I saw the ocean, I'm not afraid anymore" That really struck a cord to me since it said she was unafraid of dying becaus she finally got to do something that she wanted and was happy to have spent these things with someone she honestly and purely loved.
Yes there were unavoidable sex scenes, and this story could have done better without them, but hey, this was originally supposed to just be an eroge novel.
Anywho, I ranted enough. Clannad is starting to become more well liked than Kanon. I never really thought I would say that since i was moved by the original visual novel ending ^_^;;
Whereas it's off-topic for this particular thread, I feel that incest in fiction is not so controversial as it is in real life.
> are writte in such a way that the reader more or less fantasises about putting themselves into that position.
Well, here is the main problem I had with Kanon: Being the kind of wish-fulfillment fantasy it is, I found myself wondering: Am I really supposed to want this? Am I supposed to desire women like these, women who are this emotionally and intellectually immature? Am I supposed to desire women who are not even human?
The whole thing is empty. There is no human heart in this fantasy. It is a fantasy of a fearful and insecure mind, and when you place yourself in the story, it is cold and barren, and frankly, somewhat frightening.
I guess I can see where your coming from. In reality though, the emotionally immature statement is true. but only to an extent of a few of the chars. They are really, IMO, metaphors of the rue emotion. mais insecurity, makotos fear, ayus hope, and nayukis dependance.
I could be wrong though, And for the most part, the story is centered on people who would want that kind of fantasy in retrospect.
I think fred gallagher of megatokyo summarized this best in part of his manga that the point of visual novels was to connect with peoples fantasies and help them to come to terms with their emotional state. If that isnt what he was really going for and if thats not what youdrew from it then I missed the real point which is likely to happen.
I think though, that the emotional immaturity of the characters in kanon are tailored to a target audiences wants and needs.
Perhaps It is just because other people want more in their fantasies. Me, I didnt feel that emotional connection in Kanon but I liked the other aspects of it. the artwork the layout for the story and especially the music.
The only visual novel I ever really felt that emotional connection with was Kana Imouto. Only because I myself have come face to fac with the possibility of my dying in one way or another and can understand her feelings on that. I couldnt make that sibling fantasy connection though. But i respected that for what it was.
In the end, I agree with you on many points. But the way I see it, is Kanon was an achievement of its own right. Granted to more emotionally mature people their emotional states are far less developed and seemingly tailored only to the people, but to others, it is what they would want based upon their own emotional stability.
>>33
I want women who aren't even human. It would be more fun.
I'm having a thought here btw,
Isnt the telling of clannad simply falling into the exact same catagory and type as kaon did for the story arc?
I mean, you look at it, and clannad and its sequal are highly succesfull, I worry that all we are going to see is the same old same old. I worry that its gonna be predictable and hes gonna end up with nagisa.
What I want to see, is kyoani and key throw me a curvball and follow tomoyo and her afterstory.
There is so much potential there, and to not pursue it would likely be letting the fans down.
I could be wrong, but takin an already good story, then pursuing a really well done afterstory which enhances the themse of clannad would be a really smart move.
I seriously dont want to be let down with clannad.
And >>35 wrong thread I think buddy.
人生・・・かな？
>>37
ゲームによって回される生気に誰かそれのための強く強い... 不合理に強い好みがある。
I concur with #39's reasoning even if it has slightly too many kanji for me to have understood it without using the dictionary.
SAGE
I think Clannad is a pretty cool guy, eh doesnt afraid of anything.
>>36 That would be interesting if they threw us a curve ball like that! They certainly still have enough episodes to do it. Tomoyo seems to be the most interesting girl of the much. So far I think it's progressing nicely though. I've never cried so much when watching visual entertainment.
>>32 amen brotha. /thread.
Anyway, I like the show. It's good fun at times and is surprisingly moving (similarly to most of Key's unarguably cliche-ridden stuff) at others...
Clannad has not nearly enough ponytails nor mittens. How could it possibly be awesome?
>>45
It has dango
It has good story with characters who are intricate and not typecast.
Buuuut.
I digress. Insert creative reply here.
To tell the truth I like it. But I also like mittens.
I can't believe the guy is going for Nagisa though. Seriously, any other girl is a better option. ANY OTHER ONE.
>>47
I agree. For the love of god, any other one would do. Especially Kyou or Tomoyo. Thank god that the game is being translated!
Translated by Wiki, no less. Is that a first?
But yeah, I have a bit of a thing for Kyou. Kotomi too, although I can't explain it at all.
They should end it with SEEN0666.
Niggas are black
☆ HEAT
I think Kyou wins. Kotomi too.
But hey, at least he didn't choose Fuuko.
I still feel that Fuuko ranks above Nagisa. Nagisa is too normal. If I wanted a normal girl I would leave my room.
Same feeling about Nagisa.Fuuko is cuter
>>53
Oh my fucking God. Really?
Wait, is this series gonna have 22 eps? wtf, I saw Ep23 on wikipedia as an "Extra".
I just stared watching this. Why is Tomoya such a dick to Furukawa? It makes me too sad to watch it when he's just calling her an idiot half the time. Her dango family is too fragile to be constantly hounded by his brutality.
She copes with it fine IMO, and gets completely used to it eventually.
Presumably the reason is "because Key wrote evil lines and the player actually chose them."
has clannad stopped sucking yet?
shit was shit from episode 5 till the end fo the fuko arc.
it went up and became not shit. Now its all prepped for the second season with mixtures of win fail and bawwing.
Though some say its not fail.
But then clannad is catered towards slice of life (with harem fail elements)
Needs moar SEEN0666.
Anybody knows the relation between these two pairs of Twin?
They both have the same hair colour, almost the same accessory,
and... to me they're the same characters.
LUCKY STAR Vs CLANNAD Twins...
That makes the LS version a rip-off.
Haruhi would be a rip-off as well in that case, because of the fact that in both series there is a guy helping a girl start a club. The inclusion of another genius girl that does the same exact thing as the one in Clannad (except in the literary club's room) doesn't help either. But Clannad's genius girl is way more awesome than Yuki, unfortunately.
slowly moves off the side of the pillow, then encouragingly pats it a few times "Would you like to read with me?"
Aaaahhhh.....
But Haruhi came out in 2003 whereas Clannad came out in 2004.
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