So, did this finally come out? It hasn't arrived @ my local dealer yet, but was supposed to come out in April...
Anyway, ITT Genshiken manga! BANZAI! BANZAI! BANZAI!
Vol 1-3 by Del Rey
http://www.randomhouse.com/delrey/catalog/display.pperl?isbn=0345481690
http://www.randomhouse.com/delrey/catalog/display.pperl?isbn=0345481704
http://www.randomhouse.com/delrey/catalog/display.pperl?isbn=0345481712
Genshiken Anime
http://4-ch.net/anime/kareha.pl/1099441688
English Genshiken stuff for Share
http://bbs.shii.org/read.php/download/1102707466/
It won't stop me from buying it, of course, but... that is one ugly logo.
FFS, would it have been that hard to find a paintbrush font? Plus that freaking green background...
Well, I bought it, and it's a decent translation. In fact, I found a few spots where their phrasing was more appropriate than JJ's. However, there are a couple of awkward moments, especially the "You don't strip her, you fuck her" "You monster!" scene. It becomes "You don't only strip her, but you also screw her, too." "You freak!", which I think loses some of its comedic punch. The use of fanzine for doujinshi is a bit odd. They did make an effort to footnote the cultural references, but there were a few omissions. The "kugapii" omake strip loses the punchline in-joke "Don't get us sued!" for a more generic silly name gag. These are minor issues, though, and I'm happy with it so far.
I agree about the doujinshi / "fan-zine" thing. They could just have explained it in their footnotes at the end. By the way, I like footnotes on the actual pages better. With no hint of a footnote, it's kind of bothersome to have to flip to the end all the time to get your infos.
I will have to compare Jinmen / Del Rey a bit more, but another thing that struck me as odd was in chapter 4 with something Madarame was saying:
Jinmen
[speech bubble #1]
Ahh... we will now commence our 256th...
[speech bubble #2]
"This week's Kuji-An was awesome" conference."
Del Rey
[speech bubble #1]
Ahhh... that's episode 256...
[speech bubble #2]
Well, it's time for our "This week's Kujibiki Unbalance was awesome" meeting.
The latter translation doesn't seem very consistent with last page of that chapter:
Jinmen
[speech bubble #1]
Ahhhhhh.........
[speech bubble #2]
Now commencing our 4th...
[speech bubble #3]
"Maybe Kosaka isn't an otaku" conference...
Del Rey
[speech bubble #1]
Okay.
[speech bubble #2]
Time for the 4th...
[speech bubble #3]
"Kousaka isn't really an otaku, is he?" meeting!
I mean, isn't it an obvious repetition of the joke before in the same chapter? Consistency is a virtue in translations, David Ury!
So far, I can say that Del Rey indeed omits too many cultural references. That's not good for a translation of a manga like Genshiken. Jinmen put more effort into explaining the references (instead of rewriting the dialogue to avoid having to explain them, like Del Rey did in several parts) and some of their wording was more... to the point, like >>4 mentioned.
But overall, Del Rey's translation job is pretty solid and well done.
Also, it's pretty cool that there will be a guaranteed and pretty fast release of the chapters we haven't seen translated, yet.
Found it last friday, in a mainstream bookshop, in Finland. Woohoo!
Kosaka is my wife!
The cultural references are oddly inconsistent. They go to the trouble of explaining soramimi hour, donburi or harisen, but "Parn and Deed" (Parn and Deedlit from Record of Lodoss War) becomes "Pan and Dade".
Another thing along the lines of doujinshi/fanzine, "childhood friend" becomes "girl next door". In all the manga and anime I've seen, girl next door was never used for that kind of relationship. It was always childhood friend.
>>8
Yeah... I think that was the biggest problem I had with it. That and the whole "256th episode" fiasco. Don't they even mention at some point that the anime is just starting? Like, talking about possible seiyuu or something? And, yeah, the cultural references were wierdly inconsistant like that... I think Laputa became "Raputa" - yet, some references were left unchanged.
They were trying to change it to an American context, but FAILED.
Let's hope they put a little more polish in the next volume. It's coming out in July, right?
"buyt i dont speak polish!?"
>>11 Let's hope they put a little more english in the next volume. It's coming out in July, right?
fixed
etc.
I think polish is in ref. to buffing or shine, not in the language. ;)
In the original, they're talking about the 256th meeting. They make a callback to this later in the chapter, too, and they got that one right, except it doesn't make sense since they got this one wrong.
fanzine is what doujinshi means in english. so i don't see the big deal in translating it. in fact, i encourage it, we need less idiots going around peppering their language with random japanese words.
I would have been fine with something like fan comics. Fanzine brings up images of two-bit punk/indie mags with kids whining about how their favourite bands hit it big and thus immediately suck.
Ugh, I need to buy vol 2 and 3. Haven't bought them yet, if they even are available in my store.
Genshiken 2 is released [in the UK at least] on July 26. So you're not too late!
Volume 3? My copy of 2 says it doesn't come out until October. Also, still no Oguie in this volume T_T.
I read the book and liked it a lot, but don't know about the other translation. Usually though, I find the books to be better written than the subs. Maybe it has to do with which you read first...You know like when you hear the cover of a song before the original sometimes you like the cover song better.
I do see what you guys are talking about with some of the little details, but overall I thought it was really well done. And I agree with boogersnotch on the fanzine thing, I don't get what the big deal is. I don't really care about learning all the Japneese words for everything. I think "fan comics" sounds a lot worse than fan-zine. I didn't even know what the dojinshi was until I looked it up online anyway...but I figured it was something like that. I guess, I don't really know what all the references about Parn or Pan or whatever mean anyway so it doesn't really bug me. But "childhood friend" or "girl next door" mean the same thing don't they pretty much. Maybe I'm just not an otaku enough to get angry about it. Still, I thought the book was really funny and I'm definitely buying the next ones.
> I didn't even know what the dojinshi was until I looked it up online anyway...
Hmm. The culture surrounding doujinshi is quite a big part of this series, so it's slightly misleading to make up a different name for it. There's not really a western equivalent of Comiket.
And "childhood friend" is significant because it's a label for a recurring stereotype (which is used in Kujibiki Unbalance, for example).
I think the main point here is that while most translations benefit from being scrubbed of too many western-otaku style phrasings, this one is all about otaku culture, and therefore needs to retain its otakuness. It was never a story meant for the average reader - it's directed directly at otaku or those familiar with the otaku culture.
Has anyone figured out which Genshiken member wrote which of the blurbs about Kujian in volume 2? Pit Viper and Yoko are obviously Madarame and Ohno, Toshio is probably Sasahara, and the Crusher is Saki. Kosaka might be Kodama, but I have no idea about the rest.
>But "childhood friend" or "girl next door" mean the same thing don't they pretty much.
"Girl next door" can mean any neighbour girl of any age, whether the character knows her or pines for her from afar. A "childhood friend" specifically refers to someone with whom there is a close relationship while growing up. It's a common background setup in many love comedies and is why the group labelled Saki as one.
Another notable translation difference:
http://img372.imageshack.us/my.php?image=genshikench07p028jjvsdelrey9fx.png
(From the chapter 7 omake in volume 2, JJ on the left, DelRey on the right)
Too bad I don't have the raws here anymore, so I couldn't tell whether "Tanaka... a formidable man!" or "Tanaka is so... creepy!" would be correct, but I am guessing JJ's is more like it.
I almost must compliment JJ on their font editing. They often replaced sound words with proper types and sizes and also filled up speech bubbles in a way you didn't even notice there was something else in there to begin with.
DelRey kinda sucks at that...
> I almost must compliment JJ on their font editing.
That's "almost forgot to".... orz
Tyopgraphy is a lost art in the manga business... orz
>>29 I loled, if that was intentional. ...orz
hey guys volume three. they really should have done some research on the things they referenced in this volume. The names of the Gundam characters and MS were way off (because there are Sunrise-official romanizations of these things, and you've really got to look them up to know). The translator didn't know stuff like which names were for characters and which were for MS, so I have to assume no research was done. This isn't particularly hard stuff to do; there's no shame in checking the material being referenced, or reading a fansite.
And the fighting game stuff.... it's technical language, and it must have been a bitch for someone who doesn't know this stuff. They should have had somebody who does know fighting games read it over. As a fighting game dork I can tell what's being said in the between-chapter notes from the movelist in the back of the book (nearly everything references an existing game), but the actual text is pretty weird. Kohsaka's (I'm assuming him to be Toshizo; note how he beats everybody at this theoretical game) little bit about drunken Tokino is translated completely weird and off. The things he says plainly do not match with the movelist.
Everything ELSE reads fine though. I consider these quibbles but they ought to be brought to somebody's attention anyway.
>>31 Hasn't it always used parody copyright-dodging names for the anime and game references? I remember the anime calling GMs "Jimmys".
How is the print quality? And do we finally get some Oguie in this volume?
>>32
Print quality's about the same as last time. No Oguie. This book ends at the Genshiken Fire. The anime uses fake names but the manga uses the "Gundam" name often. Here are the straight romanizations they did:
"Jimu" for GM
"Gufu" for Gouf
"Raru" for Ral
And the weirdest:
"Bouru" for Ball
They got Hamon right though!
Finally got my hands on and finished Vol 3. Ohno's perverted eye gleam is so awesome. I like how Madarame is starting to show more flashes of leadership as club president and Kitagawa proving she's more than a petty bureaucrat.
Like >>31 said, it's obvious the translator doesn't have(and isn't trying to get) a clue about otaku culture which is a shame considering its integral nature to the setting and characters, as well as the massive amount of references and in-jokes. The use of fanzine irks me even more now because they used the word doujin anyways to describe the fan made games.
And I still don't know who anyone is besides Pit Viper and Yoko. orz
Somebody told me that they had to change the names Gouf and Gm and stuff for copyright protection. Anybody know if that's right?
I thought Vol.3 was the best so far. Can't remember the last time I laughed out loud so much at a manga (or any book).
ive seen the entire series, and read the manga, i have to say, i actually thought the translation was fairly well done
Vol.7 is out and it's pretty good <3 <3 <3
Volume 7 is quite good.
This, of course, is coming from a complete Ogiue fanboy.
With Volume 4 out (or about to be out), what are people's impressions of the flame-headed one?
Oh, by the way,
Pit Viper is Madarame (The extensive way of speaking)
Toshizo is Kohsaka (the obvious knowledge of fighting games)
Benjamin is Sasahara (Ritsuko Kubel Kettengrad obsession)
Fukurou or whatever he's called in English is Tanaka (it's mentioned in one of the actual chapters)
Kodama is Kugayama (Slight obsession with Yamada)
Yohko is Ohno (old man yaoi)
>>39
Sir, I am in your debt.
Eagerly awaiting Vol 4 next week!
Oh, the other hint for Benjamin is that (in both the anime and the manga) he fills out his Comifes slip with that name.
so uh volume four came out! nobody's said anything about it!
the "fanzine" translation that everybody hated has been phased out. they just call them "books" now. sadly, we see #$(#$#%*-censored profanity for the first time in this volume. does this appear in the original japanese volumes or did del rey change policy between v3 and v4?
i do in fact like ogiue. they needed a self-loathing otaku personality.
I like Ogiue a lot. Especially how she is handled later on.
>>42 It may be censored. But you can still tell exactly what is is. "Fucking Marathon!" = LOL
I was thinking that they could have just put Masterbation Marathon instead. But maybe in his case he is thinking he is actually fucking them.
I was pretty disapointed when I flipped through the english version in the bookstore. Ogiuge's grand enterance was ruined!
She after she says she hates girl otaku, she is supposed to say "Why do they like homos so much?" not "You look like a bunch of queers" or whatever. Thus Ohno's outrage. orz
As for if Madarame's line was censored in the Japanese it was, in fact the Japanese was more subtle I would say. There will be more censored talking in volume 5 as well.
Gaah!
>>46
Blarg. At least Ohno's outburst makes more sense now. Reading Love Roma vol 2 has convinced me that its translation team should be doing Genshiken. The current guy is way too sloppy and uninformed on the subculture.
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About the last bit in Vol 4, do girls really bitch about each other that harshly? How is Saki an otaku name?
>>52
of course they do. and the bit about saki is some lost-in-translation pun. i think i read an explanation (was this in the translator's notes?) the first kanji of her name is the same as the one in "moe". i'm not sure though.
They fucked up "a sister related by blood is useless" line too.
gay erotica doesn’t carry the same stigma in Japan as in the West. In fact, it’s part of the samurai tradition. That’s not to say that all samurai had same-sex experiences, but Japan before the mid-19th century was much like ancient Greece, in that it was considered acceptible for older men to have intimate relationships with boys. Some people may be uncomfortable with that, but it’s an historic fact.
Japan is the most published nation on earth, with more specialty magazines and books printed and sold there than any other country. It’s only natural that they would have more literature about any given subject. Walk into a big bookstore in Japan like Kinokuniya in Shinjuku and you’ll be amazed by the variety. Glossy magazines about everything from trains to watches to rabbits as pets. Coffee table books on the most obscure subjects.
But the main reason is because it’s big business. One of the most profitable genres in Japanese publishing is something called “yaoi”. It’s basically gay literature—from sappy puppy-love teenage stuff—to hardcore, non-consentual gay porn. And surprise! -it’s written by women, for women. For some reason, many Japanese women are really into the idea of men being together. I’m straight, but I have women friends—both Japanese and American—who are addicted to yaoi the way that guys are addicted to hetero porn.
Anime that has gay characters is usually called “shounen-ai” (or “boy’s love”) and it generally targets the younger demographic. A related anime term is “bishounen” (“beautiful boy”), which may not actually have same-sex stories, but has effeminate, idealized guys. What you call “lesbian” characters is most often “yuri”, or “girl-love”, which is also not stigmatized, nor does it preclude hetero relationships. The Japanese are way ahead of the rest of the world in accepting whatever flavor of interests a person has.
Volume 5! Ohno vs Ogiue in the first couple of chapters is pure gold.
Gaah, I've got it on order from the comics store, who haven't gotten it yet, while the normal bookstore does have it! TORTURE!
Thanks to fuckups by the comics store, I now have volume 5 anyway! It continues to be great, but the translation quality and editing sadly also continue to kind of suck. Even without having the Japanese version to compare, I could spot some minor but obvious errors (like the non-sensical scene at the print shop).
At least we finally get to the Ogiue action. I just love each and every Ogiue-enters-the-room scene, and I hope they'll keep on being a running joke. The Comicfest chapter is also really good.
I just came from the bookstore where I regulary get my manga (including GENSHIKEN). Something horrible has happened...the manga shelf has dissapeared! It used to be the shelf right next to the american comics, which now filled with even more graphic novels like 50 more copies of V for Vendetta and Superman. When I asked one of the staff, they told me all mangas have been moved to the KID'S SECTION.
Yes, that "kid's section". The one where they have bright yellow carpet and lego shaped booksheves. Now I have to get on my knees to look at the mangas because the shelves are too low! Not to mention it's embarassing to be looking at books next to toddlers.
(sniff,sniff)...sorry for the rant, but once again society has plotted to make buying manga an embarassing experience...even more than usual.
>>60
You'd better tell the manager to rectify that before he gets some irate parent complaining about their kid coming home with the adult content in Monster or DearS.
>>61
Better yet, I hope some kids grab the shonen-ai stuff on that shelf like FAKE....or maybe their moms would like it?
>>62
Haha, the neighbourhood mom book club going squee over gay teenagers is an amusing image. Seriously though, if they start getting a lot of grief they might decide manga is more trouble than it's worth, especially with the recent plateau/decrease in sales.
>>63
ur right...I'll call the store and tell the manager his boneheaded mistake. Politely, of course.
Genshiken is great !
∧＿∧ ／￣￣￣￣
（ ・∀・） ＜ Happy desu!
（ ） ＼＿＿＿＿
｜ ｜ |
（_＿）＿)
anyone know what this would be called in Hong Kong? or if it is even out here?
Good show/manga. I have the 1st vol DVD and 2nd-6th vol of manga.
7th vol is WIN for it's ecchiness ﾉｼ
I watched the anime first but I read the manga next, this story might be basic but I loved it. Lol Japanese otaku lives are kind of funny dont you agree?
The doujin making process in vol 5 made me want to make one and at the same time made me fear it.
New volume is out! The scene with the tie is made pure win by Ogiue's reaction. I also liked the Saki vs Ogiue bits, like how she manipulated her into trying cosplay. Madarame's conversation with Saki at the restaurant was odd though, a bit out of left field. Maybe there's something missing in the translation?
I read somewhere that the doujin extras at the end might not be complete. Are there any pages missing?
Maybe you were just ASLEEP when you read it? It's totally obvious what's going on.
>>72
If I remember right, there was a tiny bit left out of the doujin extras. At the end there were pages where the author of each comic made some comments in a little box, then a page of comments from the genshiken author. There was a ton of handwritten text that I'm sure would be hard to translate, though I don't have it with me at the moment to look and double check it. It was pretty cool that they included it at all though.
>>73
His feelings are obvious, yeah, but I didn't expect him to nearly confess out loud.
yeah
uh huh
Big News!
There's going to be a Volume 9, and the limited edition includes a doujinshi supplement and an audio drama CD with OGIUE! Fuck, I need to get a credit card. orz
http://heiseidemocracy.com/2006/08/30/genshiken-the-saga-continues/
http://shop.kodansha.jp/bc/yoyaku/comics/genshiken9/
We have a Genshiken image board now.
Not that I wanted to stir up a dead discussion.
Really.
>>75
I wonder if you are mistaking monologues for dialogues.
Lately it's not unusual to apply phrases-without-balloons for
dialogue. But basically it has been used to express character's
monologue or to supplement description of character's non-verbal expression with written words.
In the sushi restaurant, Madarame's whole speeches without
baloons ware never-voiced messages for Saki and himself.
He is acting usual himself, a mean aggressive pit viper,
but inside he is suffering from his hidden feeling.
Anyway, the contrast between two characters' story - Sasahara's small but happy adventures and growing up in his life,
and Madarame's sad love - is the core of the story of Genshiken.
I wish all readers of Genshiken understand and share this point
to enjoy it more.
It got hard.
Oh man, I finally read the last volume.
What a long time it's been, and what a great story.
It got hard. <-- best line in any manga I've read in recent years.
Yeah I think I'm going to be remembering that one for some time.
